AIRS DE PARIS

Creativity and Culture

Interview : Catherine Dumas

 

独家采访

法国参议员凯瑟琳-杜马

 

Senator and Councillor of Paris, elected from the 17th arrondissement, Catherine DUMAS occupies a prominent place in the field of fine crafts, excellence and luxury, particularly since her report to the Prime Minister in February 2009.

Through each of her mandates, Senator Catherine DUMAS contributes to defending the place of Paris, to promoting the image of France in the world and to enhancing its heritage.

She invests, among other things, in favour of la Table française, a traditional sector which brings together within the eponymous club, chefs, food professionals and political leaders.

In the Senate, Catherine DUMAS holds the position of Member of the Committee on Foreign Affairs, Defence and the Armed Forces. She is also President of the Métiers d’Art study group, and of the France-South Korea friendship group, Vice-President of the France-China, France-Morocco and France-Israel friendship groups, member of the Inter-ministerial Committee of Tourism and member of the High Council of Museums of France.

 

参议员凯瑟琳.杜马斯作为从第十七区选出的巴黎参议员和议员,自从2009年2月向总统提交有关精品领域发展研究报告后,在卓越工艺和奢侈品领域发挥了领导作用。

她同时致力于法式美食这个传统的领域,将厨师、食品行业的专业人士和政治领导人聚集一起。凯瑟琳.杜马斯通过她的每项任务,为捍卫巴黎的地位,提升法国在世界的形象而努力。

在参议院,凯瑟琳.杜马斯是外交、国防和武装力量委员会的成员。她还是工艺品研究小组和法韩友好小组的主席,法中、法国-摩洛哥和法国-以色列友好小组的副主席,旅游部际委员会成员和法国博物馆高级理事会成员。

 

Entretien exclusif Catherine Dumas - 2

 

Who are you Catherine Dumas among all these functions?

 

I am a politician who is more specifically interested in the influence of France and its excellence. This means that, beyond my responsibilities as a legislator, who discusses and votes on laws, I have been involved since my first election to the Senate, fifteen years ago, in matters relating in particular to crafts, gastronomy, heritage and French know-how…

If our Fellow Parliamentarians are called upon to react on various issues according to current events, it is different in the Senate where we are called upon to consider the issues over a long period of time. Thus, like many of my fellow senators,

I have been led to choose a sector of activity in which, year after year, I have been able to acquire expertise and build a network that I can make available to the Senate whenever that it is necessary. This competence is recognized by my fellow senators. In the Foreign Affairs Committee of the Senate, I therefore intervene more on the international influence of France or the diplomacy of influence.

In fact, in 2009, I produced a report on the handicraft and luxury sector, at the request of the government. It was a mission commanded directly by the Prime Minister. The idea was to take stock of the situation in the sector and then to formulate proposals for improvement, in particular for handicraft, schools or training courses…

This report and my involvement, for many years, with professionals in the sector, I hope that have contributed to advancing mentalities, in the population in general and in the political world in particular. I have also noted, with great satisfaction, that the Prime Minister, Elisabeth Borne, has shown her interest in handcrafts, from her general policy speech. She is actively followed by the Minister of Culture. It’s better this way ! If things start to move, the period will be conducive to progress!

 

So you see an evolution in people’s minds?

 

Yes, it is really noticeable. French society is evolving and policies are accompanying this evolution. We return to the “fundamentals” and manual training is better valued.

Expertise is the very essence of luxury. When I started working on these subjects, the brands did not highlight their craftsmen enough. “The intelligence of the hand” was not given due consideration. The brands have since understood this, because there is a real quest for meaning among their customers. Demand is strong, so these brands adapted very quickly. They know that stands there, the very foundation of their story, the one that will be told…

Today, there’s a real appreciation of craftspeople and manual labour that’s quite extraordinary. We’ve come to realise that the craftsman is someone who has both the genius of the artist and the hands of the craftsman…

 

How do you view China?

 

I really like China. The trips I have been able to make, sometimes at the highest level, allow me to better understand China and the Chinese, including the difficulties that can be encountered in the context of world affairs…

I have a real appetite for China. It’s a pretty wonderful country. This does not prevent me from expressing to the Chinese authorities my disagreements on certain points. Chinese culture impresses me, it is extraordinary! I particularly like the intellectual agility and adaptability of the Chinese. In my eyes, China is much more accessible than people say, you just have to make an effort. The French think that the Chinese are difficult to understand… This is not true, sometimes you just have to put yourself in the shoes of the Chinese to understand them better! It goes without saying that there are important political issues, but this country does not work like ours. Their system is very different.

I haven’t been to China for three years due to Covid health restrictions. But, the last time I went there, I visited a small “model” town which showed all the Chinese capacity to put itself in recent environmental standards, and I was very admiring. China is aware of the ecological challenge and is making great efforts. With these people, I feel at ease. I have observed its evolution for fifteen years, particularly in this sector of the environment.

 

Have you been to China very often?

 

I’ve been there ten times. Including on a personal basis, with my husband, to whom I wanted to show my discoveries during official trips. I visited a lot of places. The geography of China is so varied, so interesting!

As vice-president of the friendship group between France and China, how do you work with the Chinese?

We are about ten senators when we go there and it is not for tourist! We work with our Chinese counterparts. (They are not quite counterparts because the political organization is not the same, with a very pyramidal Chinese organization).

We usually meet people with very important functions. They are often senior Chinese dignitaries.

The objective is to develop relations between our countries and we first set the themes to be addressed. Chinese officials then come to France. These exchanges and the mutual understanding that we thus accumulate make it possible to address sometimes complex questions, including those that China does not necessarily want to raise. But most of the time our exchanges are rather peaceful. Fortunately ! For example, the Chinese are very interested in UNESCO heritage, especially intangible heritage. A file that I have been following for several years for the Senate. I have just produced a report, a practical guide for the UNESCO classification…

In terms of intangible heritage, China has a great deal of wealth listed by UNESCO. There are some marvellous treasures, and it’s a pleasure for me to discuss them with them. We share cultural aspects, training, tourism, not forgetting gastronomy and arts and crafts… of course.

 

You will allow me a more personal question to conclude our meeting. Is it difficult to be a politician in France?

 

Every job is difficult. Being a woman is a particularity in political life. It is true that I have been in politics for a long time. There has been an incredible evolution. It’s easier now than it used to be. There is already access to the mandate which is facilitated by French legislation. Legislation that has evolved a lot over the past twenty years. Thus, the electoral law now imposes the “man-woman” alternation, which prevents men from monopolizing all the eligible places, at the top of the list.

Women always have a singularity in the political world, they bring, on many subjects, a different vision. It is a useful complementarity, a growing necessity!

 

凯瑟琳-杜马,在所有这些职能中,您认为自己究竟是谁?

 

我是一名政治家,对法国的卓越发展和影响力非常感兴趣。这意味着,除了作为立法者讨论和表决法律的职责外,我从十五年前第一次当选参议员开始,就参与了特别是有关手工艺、美食、遗产和法国工艺等主题研究和活动……

如果说我们在众议院的同事是根据当前的事件对各种问题作出反应,那么在参议院就不同了,我们需要长期研究各种问题。因此,像我的许多参议员同事一样,我选择我了解的这些有关的领域。

长年在这个领域,我积累和收集有关的专业知识,并建立一个相关的人脉网络,以便在必要时提供给参议院。我在有关法国手工艺、美食、和文化遗产等主题研究的资质是得到了参议员同事们的认可,因此在参议院外交事务委员会中,我常常对法国在这个方面的的国际影响力提出意见。

在2009年,应政府的要求,我提交了一份关于艺术和工艺,以及奢侈品部门的报告。这是由总理直接委托的一项任务。其目的是评估该行业的情况,然后提出特别是在艺术工艺、学校和培训课程方面的改进建议。我希望,通过这份报告和我多年来与该部门专业人员的合作,将有助于改善人们对这些行业的理解,特别是在政治领域。我非常欣慰地注意到,法国总理伊丽莎白-博尔内在她的政策讲话中就表现出对艺术和手工艺的兴趣,而且文化部长也在积极关注这个问题。这都是积极面! 如果因此行业发展有了改善,这将是一个好时机!

 

所以您能看到人们对工艺观念上的变化?

 

是的,这确实很明显。法国社会正在演变,政策也在随之而变动。我们正在回归本源,手工艺的培训需要受到重视。手工技能知识是奢侈品的基因。当我开始研究时,奢品牌们没有足够地重视他们的手工艺匠。手的智慧没有被放到它的真正价值里。

奢侈品牌慢慢地明白了这一点,因为在他们的客户中存在着对精品意义的真正追求。这方面的需求是强大的,所以这些品牌很快理解这个趋势。他们意识到,这是能讲述品牌故事的基础。 今天,确实有对工匠和手工工作的重新认可,这是相当可贵的。我们已经意识到,这些手工艺匠,他们既拥有艺术家的天分,又拥有工匠的双手…… 如今品牌管理层和制作工匠之间的关系已经改变。一些高级精品店现在甚至每年都会为他们举办专门的展示。

 

您如何看待中国?

 

我非常喜欢中国。在我去中国的参访中,有时是两国最高层次的访问,让我更好地了解中国和中国人,包括在全球事务背景下可能遇到的困难…..

我对中国真的很感兴趣。这是一个相当美妙的国家。但这并不妨碍我在某些问题上与中国当局表达不同意见。中国文化给我留下了深刻的印象,它是非同寻常的! 我特别喜欢中国人在思维上的敏捷性和适应性。在我看来,只需要你做出点努力,中国比人们想象中的要容易接触。

法国人认为中国人很难理解……事实并非如此,有时你只需设身处地为中国人着想,就能更好地理解他们。不言而喻,我们有重要的政治差异,因为这个国家的运作与我们不同。中国的体系是非常不同的。 因为与新冠疫情相关的健康限制,我已经三年没有去中国了。但我上次去的时候,参观了一个小型的示范城市,该城市展示了中国达到环境标准的能力,给我的印象非常深刻。中国已经意识到了生态问题,并且正在做出巨大努力。我对这个民族充满信心。特别在环保领域,我已经深刻观察到15年里他们的演变 。

 

您经常去中国吗?

 

我大约去过十次。其中包括和我先生一起以个人的名义的旅游,我想向他展示我对中国的发现。我参观了相当多的地方。中国的地理环境是如此多变,如此有趣!

作为参议院法中友好小组的副主席,您是如何与中国人合作的?

 

我们有大约10名参议员,当我们去中国的时候,并不是为了旅游!我们与我们的中国同行合作!(他们也不完全是同行,因为政治组织是不一样的,中国的组织是金字塔式的。)你通常会遇到一些有非常重要职能的官员,他们往往是中国的高级政要。合作目的是发展我们国家之间的关系,我们事先设定要讨论的话题。然后中国官员也会来到法国访问。通过这种方式建立的这些交流和相互理解使我们有可能解决有些复杂的问题,包括那些中国不一定想讨论的问题。

在大多数时候,我们的交流是相当友好的。有些讨论让我特别兴奋!例如,中国人对联合国教科文组织的遗产方面非常感兴趣,特别是非物质遗产。这也是我几年来一直在参议院关注的问题。我刚刚提交了一份关于联合国教科组织分类的实用指南报告。在非物质遗产方面,中国有很多被联合国教科文组织列入的文化遗迹。我很高兴能与他们在这一方面上进行交流。我们也分享文化、培训、旅游方面的想法,当然同时也不会忘记美食和手工艺……

 

请允许我提一个更私人的问题来结束我们的会面。在法国做一个女政治家很困难吗?

 

每个职业都很困难。一个女性在政治领域中是一个特殊的存在。的确我从政已经有很长一段时间了。现在这个方面已经有了令人难以置信的演变。

女性今天比以往任何时候都容易参政。因为法国立法已经为女性参政提供了便利。在过去的二十年里,立法已经有了很大的发展。例如,选举法现在规定了性别的平衡,以防止男性垄断名单上所有符合条件的位置。

 

Chinese version:

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/pL-c4AyaI_EWqLtbuEkMDQ

 

 

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